Dodge avenger no crank no start

02 ram 1500 5.9. My issues with my truck is No spark- no start. It will crank all day but won't turn over. I'm 8 days down from work and really need to get my truck going again. What I have replaced in hopes of getting her going is: Fuel pump -water pump-alternator, cap/rotor, pick up coil-ignition coil, plug and wires.

6 posts · Joined 2018. #1 · Sep 6, 2018. I have a 2013 Avenger, and last night it died while I was going about 15mph & wouldn't restart for about 5 minutes. It still completely turns over. Battery is only about 4 months old. The check engine light has always come on and off bc of the gas cap.Q: No crank/No start and reads No Bus on dash, PRDNL123 Illuminated. 2004 Dodge Stratus. My car drove fine one minute and then when i tried to start it up again, there was nothing. The #8 fuse was blown in the PDC under the hood so we put in a new one and it didn't help. I have replaced the starter, ignition switch, battery, and PCM, and …Okay I have a 2013 Dodge Avenger I have replaced the battery and the starter found the blown power control module fuse replace that and still have no crank nothing when trying to start the vehicle no noise starter does not engage but the fuel pump is turning on and - lights and everything else comes on for when I turn it to start from run it does nothing.Dodge Avenger Mechanical Problems and Questions. no crank no start need help. Jump to Latest Follow 105 views 2 ...1 post · Joined 2012. #1 · Jan 21, 2013. I have a 2011 Avenger and I go out to start it and it will not start. All the lights come on and nothing just a click when you turn the key, so i boost it off and it does fine for the next few days. I checked the connections to make sure they were tight and they were, so today it does it again I boost ...Dodge Avenger Mechanical Problems and Questions Crankshaft Sensor and Multi Misfires ... 3.Hard To start 4.Rough Idle ... P0315 No Crank Sensor Learned P0335 Crankshaft Position Sensor Circuit I replaced the crank sensor with Duralast brand one at first, then with an Standard Ignition Brand that fixed all the other codes but got …

If you’ve ever experienced the frustration of turning the key in your car’s ignition only to hear the engine crank but not start, you’re not alone. This common issue can leave car ...2.4 multiple issues crank but will not start Jump to Latest Follow 862 views 2 replies 2 participants last post by Jake2.4 Jun 23, 2022Dodge Ram Generations Forum. 3rd Gen : 2002 - 2008. Engine & Performance . Ran Out Of Gas---Wont Start Now ... Crank no start, no voltage from ecm fuse. carson59; Mar 21, 2024; Engine & Performance; Replies 0 Views 364. Mar 21, 2024. carson59. C. T. Cummins crank but no start. thewanderer; Mar 13, 2024; General Discussions;Jeep, Dodge, Chrysler No Crank NO Start (Not a starter problem!) So, you replaced a lot of parts and still can't figure out why your vehicle is not starting. ... 2007 to 2008 dodge avenger . Rick Nitro Year: 2007 (1 of 91,815 sold in 07) Nitro Model: R/T 4X4 Stone White CAT-BACK Exhaust, CAI, Projector Head Lamps Fully-Equipped w/all factory ...Hello everyone, I'm having a very weird issue right now with my 2013 challenger. I get in, try to start it by pushing the brake pedal and pressing the start button I can hear the fuel pump coming on, but there's no crank at all (The starter is brand new replaced 2 weeks ago). As per the dash the car "thinks" is on, because it shows me ...

No crank, no start, followed by lots of lights. Last night, while 5 hours from home, my truck failed to start. The gauges all lit up, but the engine would not crank. Nothing else seemed out of the ordinary. I tried 5-6 times, and then took the key out for about a minute while contemplating what I was going to do.2014 dodge avenger crank no start, I have no power to asd. I have no power to asd fuses 23 and 26 No power to fuel pump either … read more. Vocational, Technical or Tra... It just died on me and i have these codes. P0685, p0688, p0685, p0688, p2112, p2323 it turns over with no start … read more.1 post · Joined 2012. #1 · Jan 21, 2013. I have a 2011 Avenger and I go out to start it and it will not start. All the lights come on and nothing just a click when you turn the key, so i boost it off and it does fine for the next few days. I checked the connections to make sure they were tight and they were, so today it does it again I boost ...This car does not have a bad starter motor and in this video we cover how to test a computer controlled starting system, from all of the inputs to the output...No Crank / No Start. Been working on this dodge towed in for no crank. What I've found is that there is no power on F20 Pink wire at ign switch or at WIN or coming out of TIPM …

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In this video, I will show you how we were about the get this Dodge that had a no crank no start running again.Car would crank but would not start and we fou...Attaching wiring diagrams for TIPM and PCM to help with diagnosis, may need to be on PC/tablet platform to view attachments. Wiring shown is for 3.6L engine, lemme know if yours is different and can send correct diagrams. Attaching no crank diagnosis flowchart to help narrow down the possibilities.3. Get a piece of steel pipe (also doubles are a socket wrench handle extension) or a metal rod, something that can reach the starter from the engine compartment. 4. Locate the starter on the engine. Carefully fish the rod or pipe, whatever you got through the wires and hoses to touch the top of the starter. 5.Chrysler Town & Country (2011 - 2010)Dodge Nitro (2011) Dodge Durango (2013) Dodge Journey. Dodge Grand Caravan. Jeep Liberty. Jeep Wrangler. Volkswagen Routan. RAMs Models 1500 - 5500 (2011-2012) RAM C/V: Relays: Mechanical: Most Common Failures: Headlights, Tail lights, Trailer lightsHard Starting: Causes: Circuit Board Corrosion ...Dec 17, 2022 · MECHANIC. 108,042 POSTS. Hi, Steve, if the C10 pin at the TIPM has no power, the TIPM is the likely cause. The TIPM receives power directly from the battery. If we are getting now power out from the TIPM, chances are there is a failure within the printed circuit board integrated into the TIPM. See pic below. 2008+ Dodge Avenger 2.4L 4cyl. Remove plastic cover on top of engine, just pull on each corner for it is friction fit. Once removed you will see 4 black spark plug covers with one hex type screw holding each. Remove Hex screw and place aside, pull upward to remove plug boot from plug. To remove the plug, use a 5/8 socket with a 6" extension.

4 posts · Joined 2011. #1 · Jul 30, 2011. it turns over just wont start. the first time it happened i wiggled the fuel injector connections and the connections going to what i assume are the coil packs or plugs under there somewhere. i also opened the air box cause it is due for a filter change. it then started right up after i did all this ...08 dodge avenger no crank no start 2 Answers. 08 dodge avenger no crank no start mostly happens when outside tempurature is below 65 degrees , if outside temp is 70 car starts fine when car does not start has no communication with pcm .replaced...In this video I have a look at a 2015 Dodge Journey that was towed in for a no crank condition. The power of visual inspection comes through strong in this v...2.7 V6 No Crank/No Start. Hello! Just recently I purchased a 2008 Dodge Magnum 2.7L V6 (130,000 miles) with a ticking engine, speculating that it's just the spark plugs or the coils. At the time of sale the engine had a p304 and p306 misfire codes.no crank no start using Key. 21013 Avenger 2.4 stopped to get gas and car would not crank, dash lights light and go out but no attempt to turn over. Battery tested and load tested good, fuses all checked and relays swapped. not getting 12 volts to ignition trigger wire on starter. Did jump the ignition trigger wire to 12 v with key in the on ...In this video, I will show you how we were about the get this Dodge that had a no crank no start running again.Car would crank but would not start and we fou...1y. F20 is an input to the TIPM. The WCM sends a bussed message that the key is in run or start. The F20 circuit is a hardwired input that only has power with the ignition switch in the run or start position. The TIPM needs to see both the bussed message and the F20 input from the ignition to allow the starter to crank.Dec 17, 2022 · MECHANIC. 108,042 POSTS. Hi, Steve, if the C10 pin at the TIPM has no power, the TIPM is the likely cause. The TIPM receives power directly from the battery. If we are getting now power out from the TIPM, chances are there is a failure within the printed circuit board integrated into the TIPM. See pic below. One of these fuses blowing could cause your no start problem. Are your spark plugs covered in gas. Plugs foul very easily and cause the car to turn over but not start. Change your plugs even if they were new. Bad ECU or blown fuses = no spark or no injector pulse Bad CAS or CAS connection = No spark Timing off (Highly unlikely) = turn over and ...No crank no start 2000 Dodge ram 1500. I have a 2000 Dodge Ram 1500 5.2 engine that I got free. The truck has sat for a year and was recovered in Baltimore after being stolen. The previous owner said the truck ran ok before the theft. I replaced the ignition switch (the original one was punched by the thief) and it still will not crank or start.

Crank, no start 2009 Caliber SXT 2.0. First this is not my car, it belongs to my niece but I work on it. It was was driven and parked in the driveway for a week. When she tried to start it, it would turn over but not start. It sounds like a broken timing belt (I know it has a chain). Only codes are for intake runner control and evap. system.

2005. Engine. 5.7 HEMI. If no codes showed up, what happened on my 98 5.9 V8 was that it hit -15 one night here in Northern MI and my fuel tank was at an eighth of a tank. Too much water in there and the gas froze. After troubleshooting the sensors and the ASD relay, I put some HEET in the tank, but no start.46664 posts · Joined 2002. #5 · Mar 2, 2015. Get one of these advance, auto zone have them too. plug it into the cap and hook your wire to it and you can see it through the windshield. I'd rather push a DODGE than drive a chevy or a ford!!!!!! 77 400/727 RC. 79 360/727 RC. 80 318/435 TD.1998 Dodge Avenger 5 speed. Replaced clutch and now car won't start. The car cranks like it's going to start and won't turn over. Battery is good, engine has spark, fuel pumy kick on but seem to be lacking ignition of spark.PRINCIPAL/DODGE & COX INTERMEDIATE BOND CIT TR- Performance charts including intraday, historical charts and prices and keydata. Indices Commodities Currencies StocksP 0340 crank sensor I put a new one on It wants to start but it's not combusting. 15 people found this helpful. Turn the ignition to the on position then off position 3 times and if there's a code it will pop up where the odometer mileage is located. There are 2 sensors that I had the same problem with on myour 2005 neon.I have a 08 Dodge Avenger vin# ***** everything powers up and lights up but no crank and I only have one key but it unlocks and locks the car and alarm just fine I read if it was the WCM a lil red dot light should stay on indicating something mite be wrong with the immobilizer but it turns off like normal Only the check engine and red lightning ...It shows the messages on the dash where the speedometer is. Codes. - P0123 The TPS sensor circuit A range output to the ECM went above the specified voltage. - P0222 Code P0222 is triggered when the voltage output from the Throttle/Pedal Position Sensor/Switch to the PCM is too low. - P0523 Code is triggered when PCM sees too high of value in ...Ram Year. 2001. Engine. Reg Cab Short Bed Ram 1500 5.2 5 Speed 4x4. my 01 ram 150 5.2 gas with a 5 speed nv3500 4x4 Cranks Bust Wont Start. 3 weeks ago i fired it up ran fine went to move and it died. pulled codes with the key trick came back to a coil. changed the coil tried to fire it, cranked but wouldn't fire. swapped the asd relay for ...8 posts · Joined 2016. #1 · Jun 19, 2016. I just got a new to me 2012 dodge avenger se, amd it has a few issues. One of the main issues is the ignition. When you go to start the car, you have to stop amf hold the key in the statt position fot a second before the car actually starts up. Then, when shutting the car off, after turning the key ...The 2012 Dodge Avenger has 2 problems reported for engine turns over, won't start. Average repair cost is $650 at 63,800 miles.

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7 posts · Joined 2022. #1 · Sep 12, 2022. No crank no start,Let me start out by saying hello everyone I am Dan. I’m new on here just bought my first Dodge Challenger SE with a no start no crank issue. I have a 3.5 L V6. I get no lights on the dash when the fob key is inserted except a red small dot small amber light that comes on and stays ...I have found the problem. If your experiencing this problem (Car not starting or making any noise, flashing red circle on dashboard) You should replace your positive power cable (The one that connects the battery to the starter) That worked. Hope this helps someone! Thanks, Dodge Durango 2005 SLT 4.7 V8.No crank, no start, followed by lots of lights. Last night, while 5 hours from home, my truck failed to start. The gauges all lit up, but the engine would not crank. Nothing else seemed out of the ordinary. I tried 5-6 times, and then took the key out for about a minute while contemplating what I was going to do.Replaced TIPM now have no crank issue, just since this morning, and no not to my knowledge, 2008 dodge avenger SE 2.4L, - Answered by a verified Dodge Mechanic ... I have a 2012 Dodge Avenger that intermittently will no crank, no start. I put in a new starter, then a new battery, and the alternator good.539 posts · Joined 2009. #8 · Jan 2, 2014. If there are no codes, and since your transfer pump is pumping, get to one of your injector lines and just crack it open and try to start. If you see fuel, close the line off and if it still will not start you need to check pressure on your high pressure pump.It must be held ,just like turning it to start up normally. If you have power at that wire then you have a bad starter. If no power we will need to dig into cars wiring …Its just 2 wires. You should check every module to see if you have voltage on that can c pins. Just stick a multimeter on the 2 wires. If you don't see about roughly 1 - 2 v then your issue is broken wire on the can c bus somewhere thats grounded or doing something. obviously start at the tipm and move outwards.No Crank/No Start. Hello all. Please forgive me if this is the incorrect place to post this, if so, just direct me to the correct one. I have a 2013 Dodge Dart Limited (1.4 liter/4 cyl) with a little over 67,000 miles on it. Yesterday, I drove my car home from work (approximately 10 miles/20 minutes), went inside for 10 minutes, and came back ...Engine will have no spark, and you will not hear the fuel pump run when the key is turned on, therefore, no fuel pressure. These same symptoms have been noticed if a Fuel Pump Relay goes bad or during a computer failure. The Fuel pump relay should not cause a loss of spark. What to check.SOURCE: 2000 dodge intrepid won't start. If the key is returning to the 'Run' position as it should, then either a relay controlling the solenoid or the solenoid itself is hanging up. The heavy contacts that send power to the starter can develop rough surfaces that can temporarily weld themselves together causing the starter to run on even ...C. chuckd63 Discussion starter. 1 post · Joined 2016. #1 · Nov 27, 2016. I'm looking for help. My son's 2008 avenger 2.4l pzev engine will crank but will not start. I decided to change the spark plugs and igniters just because of the mileage 121,000. Battery is about 1 year old. I verified the voltage at each igniter and at each injector with ...One of these fuses blowing could cause your no start problem. Are your spark plugs covered in gas. Plugs foul very easily and cause the car to turn over but not start. Change your plugs even if they were new. Bad ECU or blown fuses = no spark or no injector pulse Bad CAS or CAS connection = No spark Timing off (Highly unlikely) = turn over and ... ….

In this video I go through a quick Crank sensor(P0335)diagnosis. Just Remember that there are other variables to be considered. I was able to call this senso...Check for spark, pull one of the spark pug wire of a plug and insert the metal end of a screwdriver into the end of the wire. Lay the wire and screwdriver onto the metal part of the engine and have someone crank the engine. (dont touch the screwdriver while the engine is cranking or youll be screaming obscenities)Dodge Avenger Mechanical Problems and Questions ... no crank no start need help. Jump to Latest Follow 105 ...Intrepid. 6952 posts · Joined 2013. #4 · Dec 4, 2023. Here are the possible causes of P0302: "Faulty Spark Plug #2. Clogged or faulty Fuel Injector #2. Faulty Ignition Coil #2. Fuel Injector #2 harness is open or shorted. Fuel Injector #2 circuit poor electrical connection.Nov 27, 2016 · C. chuckd63 Discussion starter. 1 post · Joined 2016. #1 · Nov 27, 2016. I'm looking for help. My son's 2008 avenger 2.4l pzev engine will crank but will not start. I decided to change the spark plugs and igniters just because of the mileage 121,000. Battery is about 1 year old. I verified the voltage at each igniter and at each injector with ... Check wires going to spark plugs. If the coil is getting no 12V on the ignition side check ignition. It is strange that one coil has no power, the engine usually does not start when that happens because the same coil gives power to spark plugs on different cylinders. Check if there is a capacitor fixed to the head aside the coil (there should ...If you’ve ever experienced the frustration of turning the key in your car’s ignition only to hear the engine crank but not start, you’re not alone. This common issue can leave car ...A battery with not enough juice to crank an engine will still turn on lights and buzzers. I'd make sure all your main power connections are tight and clean (battery + and -, starter leads and auxiliary post under the hood), replace the fuses mentioned above, then check your PCM connection harness at the box and the connector to make sure they are clean and not corroded. Dodge avenger no crank no start, 08 dodge avenger replaced trottle body and put another electronic gas pedal on wht else can be the issue of why lighting bolt is still onim stund dont know what else would cause this. ... Start a new Dodge Avenger question. Looking for a Used Avenger in your area? CarGurus has 592 nationwide Avenger listings starting at $900. ZIP:, Replace the plugs replaced fuel pump and filter n the ignition control module n it starts n then dies out while driving n then won't start back up. Dodge Avenger Engine May Not Start at Times - 612 reports. Learn about this problem, why it occurs, and how to fix it., Chrysler Town & Country (2011 - 2010)Dodge Nitro (2011) Dodge Durango (2013) Dodge Journey. Dodge Grand Caravan. Jeep Liberty. Jeep Wrangler. Volkswagen Routan. RAMs Models 1500 - 5500 (2011-2012) RAM C/V: Relays: Mechanical: Most Common Failures: Headlights, Tail lights, Trailer lightsHard Starting: Causes: Circuit Board Corrosion ..., The practical 1964 Dodge 330 Super Stock Two-Door Sedan is a loving recreation of an authentic factory issue Hemi-engine Super Stock car. Learn more. Advertisement Sometimes the se..., It would turn over but no start. Replaced Crankshaft Sensor still same issue. Tested spark with plug tester works fine. Checked fuses all good. Engine code p0522 replaced oil pressure sensor/switch. No code still no start. Tested with ether started right up. No fuel pressure in rail (Tested with no guage)., No crank no start – Chrysler product No crank no start – Chrysler product. Alright, so you’re turning the key and getting No crank no start. Well, in the old days, the power ran from the ignition switch down to the starter solenoid and then to the starter motor. There’s no way car makers are gonna make it that simple for you., 11 posts · Joined 2015. #1 · Nov 24, 2015. I have a no crank, no start problem, it is an 08 Nitro with a 4.0 litre engine, automatic, remote locks and start. The truck has 78000 kms on it. Changed the starter, try it in park, cranked once for a second, won't crank after that. Tried it in neutral, cranked for a second and quite (three times ..., Dec 17, 2022 · MECHANIC. 108,042 POSTS. Hi, Steve, if the C10 pin at the TIPM has no power, the TIPM is the likely cause. The TIPM receives power directly from the battery. If we are getting now power out from the TIPM, chances are there is a failure within the printed circuit board integrated into the TIPM. See pic below. , Dec 12, 2022 · Crank No Start. My 2011 Dodge Avenger Express has had 2 Crank No Starts, both being when the car has sat for multiple hours. It had about a month between both No starts with very little issues i between. The car won’t start, but if you try to start it multiple times, let it sit for 20-30 minutes then try again it’ll eventually start. , Looking for a Dodge dealer near you? The first place to start is by identifying the main features you are looking for in a Dodge car dealership. The three main factors to consider ..., 1 post · Joined 2012. #1 · Jan 21, 2013. I have a 2011 Avenger and I go out to start it and it will not start. All the lights come on and nothing just a click when you turn the key, so i boost it off and it does fine for the next few days. I checked the connections to make sure they were tight and they were, so today it does it again I boost ..., Attaching wiring diagrams for TIPM and PCM to help with diagnosis, may need to be on PC/tablet platform to view attachments. Wiring shown is for 3.6L engine, lemme know if yours is different and can send correct diagrams. Attaching no crank diagnosis flowchart to help narrow down the possibilities., Helping out another shop with a cranks no start condition on this 2014 Challenger. It was setting codes for the control circuit of the ASD relay even though ..., It may be possible that your alternator is bad and discharged your brand new battery. Take both the battery and the alternator to your local parts store and have both checked. It should be a large black plastic box near the battery--the lid pops off and all parts are function identified on the underside of the lid., fisherktm. 11 posts · Joined 2010. #5 · Jan 23, 2011. This could be related to a leaking fuel injector when engine is off and causing the cylinder to be too rich on startup. Most technicians will pull the fuel rail and watch for one leaking and monitor the drop in fuel pressure in the rail. Like., 64 posts · Joined 2020. #1 · May 2, 2021. Bought a truck, crank no start. Pulled all the fuses All the fuses are good. All grounds look good besides the one on the block coming off passenger side. Gunked up in dirt and mud. All gauges work, check engine light flashes with key on, throws a code for p0573, fuel pump kicks on inside tank and has ..., Sep 13, 2015 · 08 dodge avenger no crank no start. Asked by aljjr Sep 13, 2015 at 11:31 AM about the 2008 Dodge Avenger SXT FWD. Question type: Maintenance & Repair. 08 dodge avenger no crank no start mostly happens when outside. tempurature is below 65 degrees , if outside temp is 70 car starts fine when. car does not start has no communication with pcm ... , 10 posts · Joined 2018. #1 · Feb 10, 2018. Hi. New here. I have recently started having problems with the wife's 2011 avenger 3.6 when she is going down the road and one time while at idle the engine stalls. It seams that 2-3 times this month it has happened from what she said it's when she is hitting the brakes., 2010 Dodge Avenger Starting Issues. I have been having random issues with my car not starting. 9/10 times the car starts fine no problems. However every now and then and majority of the time it happens more in the winter. You try and start the car and the engine just keeps cranking and cranking and nothing happens., Engine Cranking, No Start. Here are the common issues that can cause your Avenger to crank but not start. Your car’s engine needs air, fuel, and a spark to run. It is highly likely that if the engine is cranking but not starting that it has thrown an OBDII code., fisherktm. 11 posts · Joined 2010. #5 · Jan 23, 2011. This could be related to a leaking fuel injector when engine is off and causing the cylinder to be too rich on startup. Most technicians will pull the fuel rail and watch for one leaking and monitor the drop in fuel pressure in the rail. Like., No start problem..., 2. Corroded Battery Post. A corroded battery post can easily create a condition where your Avenger hesitates to start. It also happens to be the easiest thing to check on this list. With that in mind take a look real quick and see if there's any corrosion or battery acid on the battery cables or post., Dodge Dakota engine will not turn over refers to when an internal combustion engine will not start up and begin to run properly. More specifically, it is a condition where the crankshaft does not turn in order to start the engine. When a crankshaft does not turn at all it usually means the block has either seized or the starter has failed to ..., About Press Copyright Contact us Creators Advertise Developers Terms Privacy Policy & Safety How YouTube works Test new features NFL Sunday Ticket Press Copyright ..., 2012 dodge avenger crank no start - Answered by a verified Dodge Mechanic. ... 2012 dodge avenger crank no start. Customer Question. 2012 dodge avenger crank no start. Submitted: 3 years ago. Category: Dodge. Ask Your Own Dodge Question. Share this conversation. Answered in 24 minutes by:, No crank, no start. Weird issue with the D, ned someone to check my reasoning and see if I'm missing something. We had a cold snap right after XMas, subzero F for a couple nights, killed the battery in my pickup and caused a no start in the D, under voltage. Replaced the battery in the pickup, all good (bad cell)., 2016 Dodge Challenger Plus 3.6LThis vehicle was towed in with a Crank No Start condition. In this video I'm performing the step I took to verify a faulty Fue..., Intrepid. 6952 posts · Joined 2013. #4 · Dec 4, 2023. Here are the possible causes of P0302: "Faulty Spark Plug #2. Clogged or faulty Fuel Injector #2. Faulty Ignition Coil #2. Fuel Injector #2 harness is open or shorted. Fuel Injector #2 circuit poor electrical connection., The most common causes for flickering dashboard lights and no engine crank in Dodge Avenger are weak battery, corrosion on battery terminals, and bad ground connection. 1. Weak battery. The leading cause of flickering dashboard lights and no start in Dodge Avenger is weak battery. You may also hear rapid clicking noise when you try to start the ..., Engine. 5.7L 4x4. So, I've been dealing with this issue for a year now, and no mechanics could figure out why its doing this: After when the engine has been running and gets warm after driving it, once you shut off the engine and let it sit for 30 minutes it does this: November 22, 2021. www.youtube.com. No Check engine lights., The PCM will not deliver fuel until the engine position is determined (cam/crank sync is achieved). Once engine position is determined, the cam is not referenced again. The pattern between the cam and crank signals needs to be of "good" quality in order for the PCM to be happy. No lights or DTCs unless the issue occurs two times in a row., Still no fix. Replaced the Crank Shaft Position Sensor. Replaced the Starter. Replaced the TB. Replaced the Spark Plugs. Tested the power and ground wires for both the Crank and Cam sensors (both fine) Went to test the Wire from PCM to sensors and now the car will not turn over at all.